Splitting a Satellite Signal for 20+ TV's with individual receivers

[freethatsignal]

I need some expert advice ..

Is it technically possible to split the signals from a single dual output Cband LNB to 20 plus receivers without any lost of either V or H frequencies?

If with the right type of multi-switch devices what would be the max number of points or outputs from a single LNB, do i need signal amplifiers?

Can I run the splitted signal through the exisiting coax cable which carries the TV signals.

I've only ever split to 3 points, this is a huge project and I need some help from you guys..

thanks

[sba-fta]

Originally Posted by freethatsignal

I need some expert advice ..

Is it technically possible to split the signals from a single dual output Cband LNB to 20 plus receivers without any lost of either V or H frequencies?

If with the right type of multi-switch devices what would be the max number of points or outputs from a single LNB, do i need signal amplifiers?

Can I run the splitted signal through the exisiting coax cable which carries the TV signals.

I've only ever split to 3 points, this is a huge project and I need some help from you guys..

thanks

G'Day freethatsignal;

To first question: Yes, provided that the LNB has the capability of having the one polarity on the lower half of the IF band and the other polarity on the upper half of the IF band. Hopefully the FTA receivers can tell the difference where on the IF band the polarities are located.

To second question: You'll need a few distribution amplifiers (hopefully someone here knows of one) and splitters (that are rated) to cover the 900 MHz to 2150 MHz IF band.

To third question: No! Not a very good idea. It is rarely possible. I've heard a mixture of scream (horror) and success stories for this idea. If you're willing to have a go at this approach, you'll need RG-6 quad cable at the bare minimum. The cable has to be nearly decibel flat to 2150 MHz.

Anyway, you'll need to have RG-6 quad cable for the satellite IF band.

Hopefully this will get you started.

[blackcrusader]

The client needs either a twin out Cband LNB which has One Vertical and one Horizontal feed, or a dual or quad out, then the best way is to send that to two 8 in 12 out multiswtiches so that they can feed up to 24 receivers.

Then each receive can have both Vertical and Horizontal. Then run that to the multiswitches. You can splie the V & H is you need to multiswitches.

Now for combining it into the current RF coax the system needs a diplexor for each line joining both incoming RF and Sat coax then before TV needs another Diplexor to separate the Sat signal to receiver and RF to TV. You cannot just run one shared coax you need separate coax to each point for each TV.


You should not need any amplifiers if your dish has sufficient attenuation. However multiswitches do creat some loss and you can try an in line amp before the switch but only as a last resort. I did so after a 100m incoming coax run from dish to multiswitch

Or simply get a larger dish than you would normally install.... so if normally using a 1.2m install a 1.8m

For this install below we actually now have 3 band dishes with 4 cband satellites feeding into 2 x 8 in 12 out then 18 seperate coax lines to each point for TV. We use the diplexor just before wall entry to combine sat and RF then after wall point another diplexor to separate, in each room and in each building we did. Used 3km of coax for this one install for a private estate.

[VK2XSO]

This is an example of a distribution system.
It allows for a single band, dual polarity LNC.
If you wanted something like a Universal LNC, then a 4 port LNC would be required or multiple LNC's on a feedhorn and four distribution trunks.

RG6 quad ..... hehehe .... medicinal compound for satellite hobbiests.
If a job isn't worth doing once properly, do it four time poorly

For a short range distribution system, RG6 (whatever flavour) will do the job just fine. But if you expect to send the signal long distances, then RG11 would be better suited. Distribution amps may also be required.
Local cables can be RG6 etc.

[blackcrusader]

Originally Posted by VK2XSO

This is an example of a distribution system.
It allows for a single band, dual polarity LNC. If you wanted something like a Universal LNC, then a 4 port LNC would be required or multiple LNC's on a feedhorn and four distribution trunks.

RG6 quad ..... hehehe .... medicinal compound for satellite hobbiests.
If a job isn't worth doing once properly, do it four time poorly

For a short range distribution system, RG6 (whatever flavour) will do the job just fine. But if you expect to send the signal long distances, then RG11 would be better suited. Distribution amps may also be required.
Local cables can be RG6 etc.

Some people think 50m is a long distance.. But I have also seen buildings with conduit that you cannot put RG11 into as well.

[VK2XSO]

LDF1-75 or FSJ1-75 is next

Don't push me, or I'll tell you about LDF4-75 and how they even have F connectors (F=ool) for it !!!

[sba-fta]

Originally Posted by VK2XSO

LDF1-75 or FSJ1-75 is next

Don't push me, or I'll tell you about LDF4-75 and how they even have F connectors (F=ool) for it !!!

VK2XSO;

Neat cables. I like them. One bad thing: the bend radius is too large.

Thanks.

[VK2XSO]

Bend radius ?
Jaycar sell a 90 degree bend F-type adaptor !

FSJ is quite flexible. I might test some FSJ4 against RG6Q for my own amusement tomorrow.

[freethatsignal]

Originally Posted by sba-fta

G'Day freethatsignal;

To first question: Yes, provided that the LNB has the capability of having the one polarity on the lower half of the IF band and the other polarity on the upper half of the IF band. Hopefully the FTA receivers can tell the difference where on the IF band the polarities are located.

To second question: You'll need a few distribution amplifiers (hopefully someone here knows of one) and splitters (that are rated) to cover the 900 MHz to 2150 MHz IF band.

To third question: No! Not a very good idea. It is rarely possible. I've heard a mixture of scream (horror) and success stories for this idea. If you're willing to have a go at this approach, you'll need RG-6 quad cable at the bare minimum. The cable has to be nearly decibel flat to 2150 MHz.

Anyway, you'll need to have RG-6 quad cable for the satellite IF band.

Hopefully this will get you started.

sba-fta, thanks for the reply.

to your third answer, why would it be a bad idea to run the sat signal through the exisiting RG6 antenna cable with diplexiers? would that interfere with the exisiting frequencies? if there is no way of running new wiring to the rooms, and if i cant use diplexiers to send the sat signal to each of the rooms, how else can i do it?

Thanks all

[freethatsignal]

Originally Posted by blackcrusader

The client needs either a twin out Cband LNB which has One Vertical and one Horizontal feed, or a dual or quad out, then the best way is to send that to two 8 in 12 out multiswtiches so that they can feed up to 24 receivers.

Then each receive can have both Vertical and Horizontal. Then run that to the multiswitches. You can splie the V & H is you need to multiswitches.

Now for combining it into the current RF coax the system needs a diplexor for each line joining both incoming RF and Sat coax then before TV needs another Diplexor to separate the Sat signal to receiver and RF to TV. You cannot just run one shared coax you need separate coax to each point for each TV.


You should not need any amplifiers if your dish has sufficient attenuation. However multiswitches do creat some loss and you can try an in line amp before the switch but only as a last resort. I did so after a 100m incoming coax run from dish to multiswitch

Or simply get a larger dish than you would normally install.... so if normally using a 1.2m install a 1.8m

For this install below we actually now have 3 band dishes with 4 cband satellites feeding into 2 x 8 in 12 out then 18 seperate coax lines to each point for TV. We use the diplexor just before wall entry to combine sat and RF then after wall point another diplexor to separate, in each room and in each building we did. Used 3km of coax for this one install for a private estate.

sorry i am still a little confused, if the lnb only have 2 outputs, why do i need a 8 input switch?

the client have 2 floors, can i have 1 multiswitch on each floor? would i need an amplifier between each of the switches?

i will install 2 x 2.3 mtr extra heavy duty dish, the length of the cable between the dish to the control room is about 20meters. at the control room i will then split the signal and combine it together with the existing antenna signal to get to each one of the rooms.. should i use RG11 all the way instead??

ta

[VK2XSO]

Ok, well given that you need a minimum of 2 or 4 cables, instead of one is the first problem.
But if the old cable is still ok, then you can use sections of it.

The green cables in the diagram are your existing cables into each room.
The red and blue cables are your new trunk cables. This assumes that you can get access to the cables where they leave the rooms.

If however you can only access the cables where they call come to one central point, then you can do without the directional couplers in the picture and just go with a single large splitter and probably a driver amp, calculating the loss to each room via it's respective cable.

If your distant rooms are too far away and have too much loss, but your closest rooms have too much signal with an amplifier, then you can either;
insert attenuators into the closest room cables, or used staged splitters, so that the signals to the nearest rooms go through the most splitters while the furtherest ones go the least number of splitters.

[simmo]

I'll just add a downer (hehe) to the thread....

Should one not be profficient (sp?) in smatv systems, then the job should really be left to the professionals...
Most on Vetrun are amateurs that know their stuff...

However, taking on such a task as the OP is asking, requires RF skills and liability insurance if it dont work!!

[blackcrusader]

Originally Posted by freethatsignal

sorry i am still a little confused, if the lnb only have 2 outputs, why do i need a 8 input switch? ta

There are how many dishes with lnbs?

One Vertical signal from IS10 going to one port from one lnb

Asiasat 3 has one vertical and one horizontal thats another 2 in ports

Asiasat 2 has one vertical and one horizontal thats another 2 in ports

CHINASAT 6B has one vertical and one horizontal thats another 2 in ports

AGILA2 has one input on Horizontal thats another port

Total 8 incoming ports 4 Horizontal and 4 vertical

That is split to two multiswitches on each incoming coax....

That way we have 8 incoming feeds 18 out of the available 24 ports of the 2 multiswitches.

[VK2XSO]

just buy some RF modulators will ya BC !

[blackcrusader]

Originally Posted by VK2XSO

just buy some RF modulators will ya BC !

NO good as you have over 150 channels per receiver in 18 rooms.

150 recievers to modulators then RF'd through the estate.. yes must ask my client about that one lol

But this bar customer has 2 blonder tongue combiners going to ( now ) 25 modulators, filtered to cut out from ch 1 - 36 on his cable TV system, so he can watch from ch37 - ch 110 on his cable tv system. 110 TV's and 4 projectors